The Etiquette of Holiday fics

[geoviki]

Like all the rest of you, I'm delighting in the reams and reams of new stories and art (and this year's art is especially terrific!). There's the granddaddy, merry_smutmas, and then others like harry_holidays, hd_holidays, smutty_claus, lupin_snape.... an embarrassment of riches!

As we are encouraging each other as writers and artists, I'm trying to leave feedback as well. One thing that caught my notice, though, has left me feeling uneasy, and I wondered what your views are: In your opinion, is it uncouth to leave concrit that's negative on a fest fic? (Disclosure: this is not anything that's happened regarding my own fic, just other folk's.)

I don't see the author requesting any, for one thing. Personally, I won't do it, but then I never leave anything less than praise unless I'm asked specifically and privately. If I don't like something, I just pass it by. Which unfortunately is the same response to something I've not yet read, so the writer is never sure if I'm unhappy or just behind (if the writer even cares what I think), but there you go.

But IMHO, these stories are gifts. And I can't see criticising a gift. Am I over-sensitive? What do you authors and artists think?

Comments

personally -- and this is all just my opinion

[kagyakusha.livejournal.com]

If I can't leave completely positive comments for an anon-gift fic, then
I try to avoid commenting on it at all.
IF, on the other hand, it was a fic written for me, then I would try to find a way to thank them for writing me a fic without necessarily touching on the things I don't like -- while I think that once you've put your work out in the world then any well-thought out criticism is appropriate, my mother taught me that you should never ever criticise a gift!

[arsenicjade.livejournal.com]

It's completely innapropriate. COMPLETELY. There may or may not be a time and place for concrit--and I agree, that time and place is generally when it has been asked for and is relayed in private. I realize that I differ from the large majority of fandom in thinking this and I know that people believe that if a story is placed in the public eye it is open to that which comes at it.

That said? A fest where people are writing stories from prompts that other people have given them, attempting to best fill those prompts and everyone is anonymous and clearly has not granted consent to be given concrit?

NO.

There's no other word for it.

[urnesha.livejournal.com]

I agree with you. If a story sucks I just pass it by, I don't leave negative crit. I don't know the writing capability of the author but it takes a lot of guts to put your work out there for the world to read. If I like it I say so, if I don't I move on.

[pir8fancier.livejournal.com]

arsenicjade pretty much summed it up for me. Yes, these are gifts and they should be treated as such.

[gmth.livejournal.com]

No, I don't think it's appropriate at all, not while the fest is running. After the reveal, when everyone takes their fics and goes home, so to speak, the fics are open for con crit and reviewing just like everything else. But IMO, while the fics are still considered gifts, negative reviews and con crit is completely inappropriate. Especially if the fest is anon and the writer can't say anything to defend him/herself if s/he is so inclined. The fics will be out there for the rest of eternity; if someone really feels the need to give them negative reviews, they've got forever after the reveal.

[furiosity.livejournal.com]

Like you, I approach fest stories as gifts. I think leaving negative feedback to an anonymous gift fic closely mirrors this scenario:

In a spectacular moment of OOCness, the cast of HP are all celebrating Christmas together, and they're just in the midst of opening gifts.

Draco: omg a pony! Pansy, you shouldn't have!
Kreacher: That's the ugliest pony I've ever seen. Draco Malfoy deserves a better pony. Look at it! It's black. It should at least have a silver mane.
Harry: Wow, Ginny, thanks for the nose hair trimmer! That'll, uh, really come in handy.
Kreacher: Ridiculous. The filthy half-blood has received a gift that is completely useless, since he doesn't even have any nose hair, at least not if fandom is to be believed...
Dumbledore (conveniently back from the dead): Socks! I love socks! Who gave me socks? Was it you, Minerva? omg I love you. Gimmie some sugar.
Kreacher: Socks are for fags.
etc.

[coffeejunkii.livejournal.com]

i do leave concrit, yes, because i think it would be dishonest to leave that out and only say what i liked about a fic [well, if these things really bothered me]. i feel that most people appreciate if you mention what didn't work for you as a reader. i don't leave comments on stories that i didn't like at all. of course there are also stories that i adore 100% and i don't hesitate to say that :).

[accioslash.livejournal.com]

I'm probably overly sensitive, but I wouldn't post con-crit for any fic on any LJ besides my own. If I'm going to offer con-crit to an author I'll e-mail them privately. And I would never criticise a gift-fic, especially if it was written for me.

[coffeejunkii.livejournal.com]

huh, after reading the other comments i now feel like i must be the most horrible person ever because i don't only squee on fest fics. i don't quite understand why there's a difference between leaving concrit on anon fics and on fics that has the auhtor attached to it.

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

For me, it's not the anon/name-attached issue. It's more that quite often, the author is constrained - sometimes rather seriously - by the conditions the recipient has attached to the request. So it's no help to an author to say that the commenter didn't like, for example, a bottom Harry when that was specifically requested.

[coffeejunkii.livejournal.com]

ahh, i see. yeah, i wouldn't point out something like that, but more things that confused me or that didn't work for me regarding characterizations. i guess it would be easier to assess an author's choices if the prompt were included somewhere in the header [which is something i don't do when writing a fest fic, but it's certainly worth thinking about]. i guess i'm thinking that the author will always be able to point things out to me after the reveal and when they repond to comments.

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

*sporfle*

I love that the "anon" commenter here is being compared to Kreacher. :-D

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

Speaking from my own experience of writing exchange fics (and really struggling to create something for a specific request), there's an extent to which I couldn't be sure what was done for a particular recipient and what was just less-than-stellar writing. I mean, cruise the requests -- people ask for some pretty crazy stuff. :-P

[coffeejunkii.livejournal.com]

that's very true. i haven't looked up the requests for the smutmas fics that have been posted so far because it's kind of time-consuming to wade through pages of comments, but it's probably worthwhile to do that.

[emmagrant01.livejournal.com]

I'm with you -- I don't post unsolicited concrit at all. If I read a fic and like it enough to read to the end, I always make a comment. I point out what I liked, and I usually leave it at that. If it's someone I know fairly well, I'll sometimes point out a part that confused me. If I see a typo, I'll point that out (and appreciate it when people do the same for me).

But I guess criticizing a gift someone created for someone else just seems a bit rude to me, honestly. For example, I wouldn't criticize what my sister got my mom for Christmas, no matter how atrocious I thought it was. If my sister asked for my opinion on her choice of gift, I would give it, but unsolicited? That just doesn't feel right to me. :-P

[wook77.livejournal.com]

Concrit, in and of itself, is a gift as far as I'm concerned. It's important to me as it helps me grow as a writer. If all the comments are "SQUEE THAT"S GREAT", then I'm wondering what they're really meaning. There is always room for improvement and I appreciate that people feel comfortable enough to point out where there might be that improvement.

As far as seeing the author request any, there really isn't an opportunity for it, is there? I always request concrit on my "regular" works and would if given the option on the anon exchanges. Perhaps there should be a concrit: Yes or No option when submitting fic/art.

Finally, concrit is different from criticism as far as I'm concerned. Concrit says, here is a small plothole or this phrase was awkward. Criticism is ZOMGYOUSUCK.

/ramblings.

[spacetweenears.livejournal.com]

For the fest fic, I would give the negative concrit if asked and do it one on one. :D

[elfflame]

I feel pretty much the same. It's uncomfortable telling someone that sort of thing about a fic they've (hopefully) probably sweated blood over to get in on time. The only time I like to leave con-crit is when I have expressly talked with the author about it beforehand, really.

[slytherincesss.livejournal.com]

I think the general consensus typically is that it is indeed uncouth to leave con-crit for a gift!fic.

[slytherincesss.livejournal.com]

Which leads to the question -- which jlh actually discussed the other night -- why is there not more Draco!fic where our lordly, noble boy is a Palomino Animagus?!?! Because, yeah, Palomino=flaxen mane=Draco, natch!

Kreacher ♥ !

[slytherincesss.livejournal.com]

jlh and I discussed, that is.

[ex-marcasit.livejournal.com]

Well, I'm of the opinion that concrit should be acceptable as long as it is, indeed, constructive. I've seen some comments that made me wince because they just seemed overly critical, and there was no implication that the reader found anything to like. I can't understand leaving any feedback if that's the case.

I have to admit, it never even occurred to me to not offer any kind of concrit when commenting, because to me that's an inherent part of feedback. But thinking about them as gifts does put a different spin on that original perception. I guess mileage varies.

[primroseburrows.livejournal.com]

If I see a typo, I'll point that out (and appreciate it when people do the same for me).

I do that. Typos aren't a reflection of the work that a writer puts into a story, and I know that I like it when someone else points typos out for me.

[iulia_linnea.livejournal.com]

It's completely inappropriate to leave concrit on a giftfic. If I don't like a fic given to someone else, I won't leave a comment at all because it might ruin the experience of participating in whatever fest for both the gifter and giftee of the fic in question.

[aliciajd]

I just read an excellent mystery H/D fic and was quite stunned by other's concrit. Much of the criticism addressed a small amount of het and bottom!Harry. Neither complaint felt at all valid to me, especially since this was a gift fic and the author was trying to meet the giftee's requests. I felt very uncomfortable reading many of the comments. It seemed like a feeding frenzy was started with the first negative remarks and things just snowballed.

These anonymous fest fics ought to be allowed to experiment a bit and to break out of people's preconceived molds without garnering so much negativity.

If nothing else, if I watched a person opened a gift that I didn't like, I would never say anything negative about it.