Making sausages and fanfic

[geoviki]

I'm always curious how other writers write, so I figured I'd give it up first and see if anyone else feels inspired to follow. So here we have my nuts-and-bolts approach to writing a scene. Or perhaps merely the nuts approach - you be the judge.

This is partly the result of reading Stephen King's book "On Writing", from zionsstarfish's long-ago recommendation. I've never read a Stephen King novel; don't plan to, either. (ETA: because I thought he wrote only horror and I'm a big, fat wuss. Comments below have told me otherwise, so I'm much more likely to try his "non-horror" fic). But I thought it was an interesting book.



I've made no secret that I'm trying to finish up the sequel to A Thousand Beautiful Things (ATBT). Currently, I'm heavily revising and recasting certain parts of the plot. So where the first draft had 12 scenes, the revised version will have 7 additional scenes.

One of the writing issues that's caused me the biggest amount of work this time around is POV (point of view). The proto-draft used 3 different characters' POVs. My first beta suggested that 2 of these characters didn't play any important role in the story and probably shouldn't be highlighted so prominently. She was right, so I rewrote their scenes from the main character's POV - Draco, in this instance.

My second beta noted that the climax and resolution of the plot was fairly weak. She was right. My third beta mentioned it in passing as well. So I came up with a much more satisfying ending, discussed some of the pivotal changes with her, and began to rewrite. This new plot allows some of the other characters, who were sitting around not doing much of anything, to take an active role in the story - always a good thing! Because of the new dynamic, I realized that these characters would have scenes that only they could describe, so I knew that I'd need scenes from their POV. So I've gone from 3 POVs to 1 to 4. One of the results is that I will be writing the same scene three times over from three different POVs - an interesting exercise. But the final POV will probably be the most fun.

I've told you all that when I write long stories, I don't write the scenes in order - this has definite drawbacks, but it's the way it happens for me. The only way I can make this happen is to work from an outline, which is actually very sketchy: a table with scene no., whose POV, all the characters involved, the location and a summary, and timeline (e.g. Tues. morning). In one glance, I can look for some kind of balance in the POVs - I try to avoid a one-time-only appearance and try to intersperse the POVs for variety.

The scene I'm going to discuss is written from Harry's POV. I came to the decision to include his POV very late in the process - just last week, in fact. I'd finally managed to untangle the new ending from the wreckage of the old ending, and part of the plot gives Harry a role where he's the only character for a critical part of the scene. In addition, he has a brief POV snippet in the new prologue with an essential piece of plot. Because I have to use him both in the prologue and late in the story, I was looking to add a Harry-POV scene half-way through, for balance.

The main purpose of this new scene is to show Harry coming to a decision about what he learned in the prologue. But I also need a few things mentioned for set-up of the climax - because it's a bad move to spring on a reader all those "oh, by the way, these facts are important to the end of the story, but I didn't bother to set them up properly."

Also, this is the very first time in the ATBT universe that Harry gets to show what's going on in his mind, so I can let him expand on that just a bit. Nowhere in the earlier scenes do we get his take on how his relationship with Draco is going, so I'll let him think about that. This will also address my fourth beta's comment that the relationship issues seem too disconnected from the rest of the story.

Finally, there's an issue discussion I've been meaning to wedge in somewhere and this scene may be a good place. ATBT Draco is a fashion model. Ranks right up there with other fandom cliches like Veela!Draco, Abused-by-Lucius!Draco, or FlamboyantlyGay!Draco. But I want it to be more than a cliche - ATBT Draco is a working model, in a small studio, and I'm looking for realism as much as possible. I even have a beta to check the modeling parts - kattiya who has a background in the industry, and who points articles my way and is helping me keep it real. Many readers have commented (mostly in the background) about the cliche of Gorgeous-Model!Draco in ATBT, and I want to make it clear, this Draco is not gorgeous. I don't see him as movie-star gorgeous. I see him as someone the modeling world would use because he's got the build, the moves, and the versatility they're looking for.

I can tell from the get-go, this scene has the potential to be deadly dull. A one-person scene, the main focus is an internal decision. Could be a lot of "Harry thought this" and "Harry thought that". Blah blah blah. I can almost hear the back buttons clicking. Therefore, I need an external device to keep things moving, and I pull out one of my favorites: the journey.

Ever notice how many stories use a journey to drive the plot? Lord of the Rings - a huge epic journey. Well, I don't need anything quite so earth-shattering. I'll have Harry visit a few spots, though. A micro-journey. (I added the broom-chase scene over Belgravia in ATBT for just this purpose - it broke up what was going to be a very static "Harry-and-Draco talking" scene.) And because Harry is thinking about the past, I make him take that journey literally: he will go back to a place he saw a lot of during the war.

Before I set fingers to keyboard, I work out the scene in my mind. I visualize certain things; I can even hear some of the dialogue.

So I'm ready. I begin by making a note of the things I need to include in this scene so I don't stray too far:

-Harry thinks about Draco's appearance
-Harry goes to West London
-Harry comes to his decision
-mention facts needed for the set-up of the climax

Do I start at the beginning of the scene? Oh, poppets, you don't think that, do you? No, I start with my strongest visual image: Harry goes back to his favorite Chinese restaurant.

The front of the restaurant is one of those all-important set-up facts I need to show, so I let myself get carried away so it's memorable. I've got a whole backstory about the sign, the name, the owner -- I can tell you more about the owner than you'll ever read about. I won't use it, but I know it. This snippet lets me do one of my favorite things: write very intimately detailed slices of life.

Now I finally start to write.

I don't know what other writers' ratios of writing:rewriting is - mine's about 25:75. I spend 25% of my time writing new words, and 75% revising them. Most of the rewriting comes as I'm writing. I hack out a sentence, I go back and change a lot of the words, the order, the phrasing. Now I've read advice not to use a thesaurus, but I find it a useful tool. One of my strengths as a writer is that I happen to know a lot of words, and a lot of nuances and differences in their meanings. Not that I always get it right, but I'm better than average. And when I'm trying just to go for volume, I'll use a word I know is "almost" what I want and let it go until I can come back and find the one I know is better. But I often use the thesaurus feature as I write. I never use an unfamiliar word, though. I'm looking for precision.

Okay. Got that part done. Now I go back and really look at it more carefully. One of my weaknesses as a writer is that I'm really wordy. I'm too wordy. So I know I'll be paring away at what I've got, looking for useless additions. Delete, trim, streamline. I'm also looking for balance: Do the sentences vary in length, in structure, in content? Does the logic flow from one sentence to the next or are there jumps? Do I repeat words? Do I use too many big words when small ones will do the trick (another fault). After heavy pruning, I'm left with that description of the restaurant, Harry thinking about what he's learned in the prologue, and what he thinks so far.

I can see that Harry is subtly avoiding his final destination, and this makes sense with the plot, so I decide to emphasize that. So I'll make him visit his own flat before the restaurant. This way he can also show the current state of his relationship with Draco - he still has his own flat, it's barely used, he was here two weeks ago when they'd argued. Here, too, is where I put the Model!Draco stuff. This time, I use a flashback to a conversation - dialogue is always more interesting that "Harry thought blah blah blah." Here in this conversation, I let Hermione do the heavy lifting.

I struggle with this quite a bit. This story is written in third person past: Harry said... So to write Harry remembering a past conversation makes me have to use: Harry had said... Too much of this is ugly, IMO, so I try to use as few tags as I can get away with, which is hard with all the folks in the conversation.

I'm at the point where I can write the beginning of the scene, since I know where it goes. I add a little about Harry eating breakfast at Draco's flat, thinking about his goal for the day. Not too much. By this time, I'm running out of steam - I've been at this scene about 90 minutes. I know I'm fried when I try to entertain myself by translating some of my new paragraphs into the "tranzilate" feature of www.gizoogle.com to see what the hip-hop version looks like. (It was past tha lunch rizzush, n Harry hadnt had trippin' more substantial than tha eggs n toast hed nibbled on thizzay rhymin'.)

Day 2: I begin by rereading what I've done so far. Right away, I see that the flashback conversation goes on too long. Another fault of mine - I do this:

Character A: Here's a comment.

Character B: Oh. Says something lame.

Character A: Here's another comment.

I prune Character B's lameness away, then take out another quarter of the dialogue, including some - to me - funny but unnecessary lines. Oh, it hurts!

Then I notice that I had echoed Harry's introspective comments in the restaurant with a similar introspective passage in his flat. Cut and paste time - I move the restaurant introspection to the flat and blend, trim, cut, streamline. Phew! The modeling comments similarly have an echo at breakfast, so off they go to that part.

Harry has one more stop to make: the place he's been heading for all along. He gets a bit of dialogue with a receptionist, comes to his decision, and the scene ends with a pithy comment.

Back over the new part - you know the drill now. Ninety minutes later, I've addressed what I needed to - oops, almost forgot to mention the second set-up; I go back and add it. Current word count: 2154.

Now I'll let this scene rest a bit. Before my betas see it, I'll go over each sentence at least twice more. In addition, there are a few paragraphs I'm still not happy with. They don't emphasize enough what I want them to emphasize and are dotted with cliche phrases.

And here's part of it so far:
____________

This part of town hadn't changed. The streets were still littered with trash, the same storefronts were still shuttered and begrimed. Harry wondered briefly if it was Monday – the days seemed to get away from him, and the Peacock was closed on Mondays. One glance at the neon sign proclaiming P COCK let him know it wasn't.

The beleaguered owner of the Peacock, Mr. Li, had had a running battle with the local hoodlums for as long as Harry had visited the place. Habit had become ritual – the word proved too tempting a target, leading to a sneaky nocturnal visit, a quick burst of black spray paint, and the erasure of the E and A. Every Monday afternoon, Mr. Li would take out his rickety stepladder and slowly drag it outside, carefully climb until both feet perched on the warning: do not stand on or above this step, frown intently, and scrub at the paint with a wire brush until it was mostly gone.

Every Tuesday morning, the paint would be back. None of Mr. Li's aggrieved complaints to the local precinct made a jot of difference in catching the culprits. Harry had once made the mistake of suggesting that Mr. Li might want to rename the restaurant something less tempting like the Peahen. Mr. Li had given him a look as though Harry had suggested he chop up and serve his revered mother in the daily special.

____________

ETA My ever-alert beta has Britpicked these three paragraphs since I've posted them. She notes that "trash" should more correctly be "litter", seeing that this is Harry's POV. I know a few of the trash/dustbin/litter differences, but I frequently miss them. Some American authors don't worry overmuch about Britishisms, but I'm in this thing to learn what I can and to do the best I know how, so I always make the Britpick changes that are shown to me.

She also told me that "precinct" is an American institution. I had a strong suspicion this was the case, but I didn't know the alternative and was counting on her to provide it. And she did, in detail, so that sentence will be revised. And I've learned something new about British culture in the meantime. What a cool hobby.

With her permission, her comment is here:

The notion of "the precinct" doesn't fit how British policing works. The police are in fact a number of locally organised regional forces. That for London is the Metropolitan Police Force otherwise known as "the Met". There are police stations, but they don't cover a defined area and you might not know which one your local cop-shop was. The term "the precinct" or the "precinct house" are never used. In any event, Mr Li would probably be complaining to the Local Authority (who would be a metropolitan borough council, probably Hammersmith or one of the Actons) about vandalism, even if he did also complain to the police about criminal damage. What you'd do would be ring (using the non-emergency number, which routes to a central switchboard for the force, tell them where you were) and they'd eventually send someone round. If they wanted you to attend in person at a police station they'd tell you which one, but normally they'd come to you.

Comments

[primroseburrows.livejournal.com]

This sounds like it's going to be great--you've put a lot of thought into it. I'm working on something myself. I should go back and reread On Writing, because that's a great book to reference. It's straightforward and simple and doesn't talk down to the reader.

Which brings me to my question:

I've never read a Stephen King novel; don't plan to, either.

My question is Why? I'm really curious. What is it about what you've heard about SK that makes you not want to read his books?

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Oh, it's nothing about SK and everything to do with the genre: I hate being scared! I don't read psychologically scary things or watch thrillers or horrow movies. I'm a real wimp.

[ridicu-liz.livejournal.com]

So there are two of us in the world. I don't like being scared either, and if someone drags me (usually kicking and screaming) to something scary I do the defensive "must mock this constantly so I don't get sucked in" thing.

I await your sequel with equal parts anticipation and dread. I cannot wait to read it, but once I do the suspense will be over. I admire your dedication. It's fascinating already. Mmmmmm....garlic chicken anyone?

[mayflo.livejournal.com]

Sorry for my nosy comment but I'm such a wimp too, that'll make us three? *hee*

I avoid scary movies at ALL costs not to mention literature. There's so much I can tolerate.

But nowadays Holliwood seems to like formula of remaking of horror movies based on Japanese ones (how original *bleck*).

I can't deny they arouse my curiocity but you know what they say about the cat. So there's no way they can convince me to see those things. So I just urge my friends to go see it and then tell me about it. Why waste money and go thru' agonizing two-hour suffering when I can avoid it? *hehehe* >:D

[silentauror.livejournal.com]

*joins club*

I don't like being scared, either. My little brother (well, okay, he's in his twenties and is close to six feet tall, but still!!) made me watch The Ring with him last summer. It was dreadful. I recoil into the club. :)

[sollersuk.livejournal.com]

Ah. I put in my long comment before reading this. I'll just mention again that horror isn't the only thing he writes.

[primroseburrows.livejournal.com]

Ahh. Steve's not always about teh horror, though. He's been Labelled, and he's okay with that, but there's so, so much more to his writing. I wouldn't rec you something like The Long Walk, which is very, very much psychologically (and actually) scary, but I might rec you The Girl Who Loved Tom Gordon, which is about a nine-year-old lost on the Appalachian Trail in Maine. It's not horror; the scary stuff mostly is inside the little girl's head...mostly it's about courage.

[cordelia_v]

Hmm. I think it's not like making sausage, because in fact we do want to understand what goes into your stories: at least, by the end of this interesting essay, we do. For someone like me, who doesn't write fiction, getting a glimpse into your process is fascinating. And (as a byproduct, not your intention, I think) it becomes clear how engaged and invested you are in mastering your art, here. Thanks for letting us see inside, here.

*goes off to add to memories*

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Oh, I'm glad you liked it. I don't think we writers let people in the kitchen enough. And I wanted to disabuse (big word!) people of the idea that it pours out of me like water from the rain forest. I see too many beginners post totally unedited stories. I wrestle - Jacob-and-angel style - with every sentence. Numerous times. I tried to explain why in this entry.

[millefiori.livejournal.com]

Thank you for sharing this! It's always neat to see inside the process of another writer--I invariably pick up things I want to try for myself!

Also, if you'll forgive my pimping, I think this would be a great post for fanficsymposium. Though the group is more focused on in-depth criticism/review, I think generalized writing posts are welcome as well. And, frankly, (IMO) the group has a lot of potential, but it's struggling to gain its feet and if more people don't join and post soon it's going to fail. :-/

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

I was looking at the fanficsymposium info and am so impressed with the goals of this group! Although some of the names are a bit different from their real LJ names, I think I can guess at least a few, and it's clear you have a great group of writers. If I weren't hacking away at my sequel-fic, I'd join, but I don't think I have enough extra time right now to follow the guidelines of critiquing often enough. For this sequel, I've got 4 betas and I don't think I could handle any more input - because I know the fanficsymposium writers would be full of great suggestions that I'd feel I should address correctly. Plus I've been betaing for other authors lately and I don't think I've been giving their work the attentiion it deserves.

Oh, but I feel bad at having to say no. It's such a worthy endeavor! And it's obvious you've put a lot of thought into making it a great community.

[millefiori.livejournal.com]

Hey, don't feel bad -- I didn't mean to guilt you! And I should also add that I had nothing to do with creating the group. I joined because I've admired and respected Rushlight for a couple of fandoms now, and I felt like any group she modded would be quality. Unfortunatly, I think that since the group started, all three mods kind of got blindsided by RL, and the group just doesn't yet have the legs to stand by itself.

Anyway, it sounds like you've got more than enough on your fandom plate! Maybe (I hope!) fanficsymposium will still be around if/when circumstances change for you in the future.

[painless-j.livejournal.com]

Aww, it's really, really, really fascinating! This is writer's workshop as I want to see it!

After you've posted your story, come back to this post, copy-paste the bits of the actual text you were talking about and make it a DVDtrack commentary. Please.

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Will do. *uses Boyd icon because of our discussion*

[snottygrrl.livejournal.com]

[*adds to memories*]

wow, fist pir8fancier and now you. i think the universe is gently telling me i should get back to writing. i could always ignore it and see what sort of ways it will continue to whack me about.

thanks heaps for the insight into how you write. it is v. v. interesting

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

You know, I think some people think it comes easily. (oh, brain, do not start singing the Ringo Starr song, please, I beg you!)

If it's important enough to write, it's important enough to rewrite!

When I first began writing fiction, in the Pleistocene, I read dozens of books on the process, and it was worth it. King's book was a treat. I recommend it.

[fungus-files.livejournal.com]

really enjoyed this window into your writing process. your ratio of 25:75 for write/revise is about my breakdown too (for my professional as well as fun writing). I usually try to throw down all ideas first as I have a real problem with a blank page (screen) but I really get going when hooking up fragments or fleshing out a dialogue. I don't, however, plan out scenes very well in advance. or if I do, the end product usually thumbs its nose at me and wanders off of its own accord.

couple of other qs that occurred to me:
* do you always write/edit on-screen or do you need a hardcopy?
* had you plotted out the whole story arc before even starting the sequel?

I loved reading King's book and have enjoyed a few of his novels in my time (against my expectations - yes, I discovered them in my 'sneering at genre-fic' days. he kinda turned me). argh. will stop before this is an entire essay. *g*

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Before I forget, I got your story for beta-ing and shall work on it soon.

* do you always write/edit on-screen or do you need a hardcopy?

I do it all onscreen now. My first fic - Waters of March - was done on paper quite a bit, because I was spending countless hours watching soccer practices and getting chewed up by mosquitos. That was the last fic I've done that way. I change things too much to have a chance with the dead tree version anymore. In fact, when I went to Santa Fe I borrowed a laptop so I could write.

* had you plotted out the whole story arc before even starting the sequel?

Most of it, yes. I love that part of the writing process: I tell myself the story. Mostly in big, broad strokes. But I do flesh out the theme and the general story arc before I begin to write the first scene. This one I had figured out quite a lot beforehand; when the flaws became apparent, it threw me for only a day or two before I concocted a whole new ending. Again: big and broad. The details were a little harder to come by. This process is a first for me: I've never rewritten to such a great extent before.

I like a lot of plot in my stories. I'm not particularly poetic in my language, but I can keep a reader entertained with the "so then what happens?" kind of writing.

[sollersuk.livejournal.com]

"so then what happens?" is what appeals to me as a reader! A story can be poetic as hell, but if I don't care about the characters and don't feel any interest in what happens next I'm not likely to finish it.

Writing straight on the computer: I started off thinking "I wish" - if I only wrote when I got home in the evening, I'd never get any done. A lot gets written in the local winebar while I'm waiting for ajhalluk and a) I don't have a laptop, b) it would not be usable in all the circumstances where I write. Then I realised how useful it is to write it longhand, because I always do a lot of revision when typing in. I've also discovered that I can't revise adequately on screen: I have to print it out and scribble all over the printout, otherwise I just tinker with it instead of making a real difference.

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Oh, how you make me long to be in that wine bar! My closest fanfriend, isiscolo is actually not in Colorado at all right now; she's on her sailboat in the Bahamas.

But I am drinking wine right now; a toast to you both!

I don't think the direct-to-digital writing makes or breaks my story. Me, I've learned to skip the printed step, mostly because I deal with the digital world 8 hours a day at work. I'm used to direct typing, and I use it when I can, even though I have to make sure I have these Stupid! Reading! Glasses! at every place I sit and read. I'm also more likely to make the little needed word-tweaks when I'm skimming the story for the umpteenth read-through. But the printed version worked well enough for Waters of March. All the shmoopiness (oh, the spellcheck won't like that word) was caused by other reasons. And my very first HP fanfic was written in a tent at 10,000 feet A.S.L. and was a true compulsion to complete.

[sollersuk.livejournal.com]

I spend most of my working day at the computer so though I type faster than I think (actually, that's a bit of a problem) I sometimes need a break. The tricky bit is that I HAVE to type up after a really short time as when I'm writing as fast as I think I get not very intelligible even to me!

(And here's to you as well)

I do tend to do fanfic straight to computer (fragment of something a long, long way back and Professor Binns' Wizarding History book, which I must get back to, but I've hit a tricky period); it's my historical novel that really, really needs the rewrites!

[fungus-files.livejournal.com]

re writing longhand: I was forced to do it the other day (!) when access to a puter was not forthcoming but fodder for plot-bunnies was. I found it weirdly liberating and had edited it several times with satisfying cross-outs/inserts before it made it onto a hard-drive. I'm finding that it makes a scene come together much better for me.

and ditto re revising on a hard-copy! I can't edit/proof very effectively on-screen (actually, don't trust it is more the case). there's something too authoritative about the words on the computer screen and I'm less likely to muck with it.

[mayflo.livejournal.com]

Okay, I can definitely say that this writing business takes a LOT of time and dedication!! *phew*

I haven't read the whole ATBT yet, so I feel like I read a couple of spoilers here but I couldn't resist your offer in the mail *heh*

I wanna finish reading quick!!! arrrggghh, I'm such a slow reader.

But that wordy part, I can totally relate myself with :P I'm SO uselessly wordy too. Bad habit.

Hope to see you online sometime soon but y'know I can't for a while, yes? *giggle*

[mayflo.livejournal.com]

I finished reading ATBT!!! *beams*
Can't stress enough how much I loved it! I need to squeal like a fangirl now!!

*OMG* SO cool XD *squeeeee*

I had to let that out of my system *g*

Now that I released my fangirlishness, off to mail you my FB!!!!

This entry makes more sense now that I read the whole fic. No wonder why you came up with such a marvelous fic after going thru' all this process. I can easily tell the difference between a well-thought and thoroughly planned fic and one that's not. I'm gonna quit my ranting mode cos otherwise I'm never gonna finish XD

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

This, my dear Hannah, is known as a GIP. A Gratuitous Icon Post. I'm showing you my vision of Levon, Hermione (who is actually my daughter), Harry, Dean, and Boyd Draco.

[sollersuk.livejournal.com]

I'm going to discuss other matters later, but a brief word: don't be too prejudiced about Stephen King. There are a lot of Stephen King. There is the writer of "gooshy" horror novels. There is the writer of "The Dark Tower". And there is the writer of he Body", "Gerald's Game" and "The Girl who Loved (whatever - my daughter's got the book and I can't prise it out of her hands)". Said daughter, who is the feminist's feminist, considers there are only two writers who can really handle female characters: Anthony Trollope and Stephen King.

So if you don't like horror, give the others a chance. And if by any chance it is "this is a massively popular writer so his books must be crap", ask yourself if there is any possibility that this might be intellectual snobbery and give the books a chance.

Now to look at the question of writing - one of my favourite topics!

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Oh, now see, I hadn't thought about his other writing, because I was only marginally aware of it. I'd forgot about the Dark Tower, although am I right in thinking it's a long series of books? It may take me a while to get to them. But I was in the dark about anything beyond, so thanks for the tip.

I don't have an anti_Stephen King bent, AFA his writing. From "On Writing", I think I'd enjoy his style. So I'll give him a try.

[silentauror.livejournal.com]

It's hard to know where to even start! This is a really great bit of part-essay, part-reflection, and I'm really glad you posted it. How did I miss this before? I don't know, but I found it on the daily snitch today. Very thought-provoking.

Generally speaking, when I start a fic, there's some sort of loose idea - not so much a plot bunny as more of a concept of sorts. After a few days or weeks of just contemplating it loosely and wondering what it would look like, I start writing. I do not do an over-arching plotline at ALL, because I usually have no idea how it's going to turn out. My personal experience has been that when it comes to writing of any sort, be it poetic, academic, or - fictitious? (ha ha), I need to find a way to get myself out of the way. It's like there's a plot out there, and it will come, but only if I don't try to manipulate it to my own will too much. Like a fish, swimming in a large ocean - I leave the net out and hope it swims in, but if I move too much, or go looking for it, I'll come up empty. Sorry about the flowery analogy, but it's the closest I could come up with. I tend to write mostly as escapism, and I find myself losing sight of my actual, conscious self, as well as just getting away from my stressful, day-to-day life. If I'm writing particularly well, then everything else fades. Time, other obligations - they just go away.

There are definitely days when I just want to finish a chapter, get the ending written or whatever, and then it feels like the cogs are turning & that I'm actually working at it. Otherwise - that's really the best I can come up with; just getting myself out of the way. I've found that later, going back to earlier chapters, etc., that certain things will have aligned themselves for the plot to work out the way it did; some things will be unwittingly foreshadowed without my conscious effort at all. I do revise, definitely (more so for academic writing!), but I'd be hard-pressed to put a number to the ratio of new writing/revising.

I don't know that I would say that it's easy, but I do consider it an indulgence. I'm an opera singer, and getting away from the tensions of performing & music politics is really great. In fact, great enough that I've considered putting music aside in favour of writing, but a fanfic hobby doesn't really qualify as grounds to quit one's day job. :) I'm planning to try my hand at an actual novel of sorts next year, when I have a little more time, but we'll see. I imagine a good deal more care would have to go into my writing process, then.

Your point on POV is really interesting, and I remember thinking that when you told me about writing those scenes from multiple POV's before. Intriguing! I'm currently writing my first Draco POV fic, and it's an interesting challenge. For instance, I'd like to have Harry and Ron get into an argument, but how to do it with Draco right there, in the scene? Either, he has to overhear it, Harry has to tell him about it, he has to be present for it, or someone else has to tell him about it (like Hermione, say). Curious. The rest of my H/D's have been Harry-centric, and I'm rather liking writing from Draco's perspective.

Anyway... my three cents or so. :)

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Thanks for expanding on your process - I was hoping I'd get some additional views on How It's Done.

I use fanfic writing as the great escape - my day job is scientific, not creative the way fiction writing is. Some times I just love to sit back and go over a chapter again and again, seeing it more clearly the more I work on it. I find it relaxing, too.

[kyuuketsukirui.livejournal.com]

This is really fascinating. I don't write long, plotty stuff, mainly vignettes, and even when I have written longer stories (I think I have one that's about 30,000 words), I just wrote from beginning to end, editing while I went. (I did revise it once after posting, and am thinking about doing so again, but it's mainly just to reword things where I think I could have done better, rather than to change actual plot issues.) I just can't write out of order (unless my story is told non-linearly) or write up an outline. I've tried.

But I often use the thesaurus feature as I write. I never use an unfamiliar word, though. I'm looking for precision.

I think this is what a thesaurus is for, really. When people say not to use one, they mean don't use it to replace words you know with words you don't. But I know I often have the problem of having the word I know I want on the tip of my tongue, so to speak, but I just can't remember it. So a quick trip to thesaurus.com to look up other words that mean about the same thing often helps me find the word I already know I want.

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

I always feel a bit guilty at how frequently I do use the thesaurus. I type using WordPerfect, which has a handy-dandy one in a toolbar, right there, tempting me with all the words I could be using. Less than half the time, but often enough, I'll notice a word that's better. I can see it's better, right off the bat. So I make the change. (and wonder if I'm the only one who does that. Glad to know I'm not!)

[twigged.livejournal.com]

Fascinating! I have a very similar process to yours when I write - jumping around, working from a rough outline, revising like crazy - but I can see that you're much more dedicated to the process. Occasionally it overwhelms me and I end up flying by the seat of my pants. :D Well, and I haven't actually *completed* a novel length fic in almost 2 years. Gah. I didn't realize it had been that long. *hides*

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

You must have more natural talent than I do, then, because your fics seem so mature to me, as though you worked and slaved over a hot desk all day.

(Oh, just sayin', but if you don't have Ouroboros finished by the time I meet you at The Witching Hour, I'm going to break both your legs so you can't leave Salem until it's done. Just a friendly warning. *grins fiendishly*)

[twigged.livejournal.com]

Oh, gracious, I don't think I have much natural talent for writing, really. I have some skills that help me bluff my way through, but it's never easy. When I see that others go through the same painstaking processes as I do, I wonder if the entire concept of a 'natural' writer is a myth. Or at least a rarity.

(and thanks for the warning about Salem! I better get to work on my disguise costume!)

[charlotteschaos.livejournal.com]

Wow. Well... I would say you rewrite more than I generally do. This may just be because I'm pretty new to writing and it's entirely possible I post too quickly. Although with my longer fics, I tend to write out what my story is over a page or three. This is the bare bones one-page treatment of what is going to occur. It's not super comprehensive and there's always room for me to add or delete things as are important. It's just an expression of my overall plot bunny.

Then I try to break it up into what I think will be manageable chapter-sized bites. Sometimes these things need altering. Either I anticipated a logical jump from x to y that I can't see once I get there, or things progressed more quickly than I thought they would. I'm not sure if that ever changes or if eventually I'll get better at anticipating what will make a good chapter or not.

When I sit down to write the next chapter, I have the goals already set for it. Mostly I have it all reasoned out into scenes that I believe will work to express getting from here to there. Each segment ends up with its own little plot bunny and I sit down to write them. Sometimes, like you, I end up writing scenes out of order because I get the dialogue or the set up buzzing in my head before I get to that point. I write it down immediately, labeled by the scene. Usually the scene will need modifying by the time I get to that point, so I do end up rewriting it a bit.

Since I post as I go, I have found that now and then I painted myself into a bit of a corner. I've tried not to do that this go-round, but I'm still learning. Hmm... when I started writing this response I was thinking "I don't really rewrite much." But in truth... every sentence pretty much gets retouched. I suppose that the first draft is about expressing plot. Second look goes over word choice, sentence variations; did I go nuts with epithets again? How many adverbs did I use (teehee, I read On Writing as well) and how can I rework them or how necessary are they? Then it's off to the beta and I go over it one last time along with the changes.

My betas don't usually question plot... I often ask, "Do you think this works?" and they say it does, generally. I suppose I wouldn't mind more push back than I get, but that gets to be an awkward thing to ask. Do you know your betas really well? Or does it help to not know them very well? How do they let you know "X isn't working for me"?

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Oh, I love rewriting! I like rewriting much more than I like putting it down on paper the first time. I can't explain the difference...

I'm extremely lucky in that I have about the finest writers/editors in fandom who volunteer to beta my fics. And asking someone to look over a book-length thing is a huge favor to me, and I appreciate them enormously. My four betas for this one are isiscolo, who is a real-life editor and a superb writer, ajhalluk, my absolute favorite writer who also Britpicks for me, wayfairer who excels in character dynamic, motivation, dialogue, and plot structure, and kattiya who is helping me with the modeling world. None of them have any hesitation in telling me what I need to hear on any aspect of my writing, and I appreciate their honesty immensely.

[charlotteschaos.livejournal.com]

Well, I didn't meant to downplay my own betas, I just suppose that since they're friends that sometimes I wonder if they're blowing smoke up my skirt ;) I mean, I want to think that they really like what I'm writing as much as they say, but on the other hand... there's just some things you might not say to friends. I don't have a Britpicker, but I suppose since I don't often leave the HP/Hogwarts-verse, that it doesn't come up as often as it would as your sample.

I love the brain dump, the rush of words, the feeling of having characters speaking in my head and describing what they're doing as it's happening (although fortunately they'll stop and repeat, of course *smirks*). i love pushing through the scene when I'm not sure where it's going, but kowing where it needs to end up and finding resulotions as I write and what little bumps in the road that crop up along the way.

Going back over it is sometimes fun and sometimes painful. Mostly I see things like... "Wow, adverb abuse much?" and I get a bit petty with the words, I'll obsess, overanalyze... this is where my obsessive compulsiveness tends to come out and I get very anxious about it. In and of itself I enjoy restructuring the paragraphs, eliminating the nonsense (and especially the occassionally amusing typo), but there's a definite point at which my analysis turns to serious self doubt and that's the part I dislike.

[waterbird.livejournal.com]

I just stopped by to see if there was any news about the ATBT sequel--and what a treat!

I really appreciate when a writer takes the time to share his or her approach to the writing process. Seeing how someone else gets from idea to end product helps put things in perspective. I'm just getting back into fiction writing after a *very* long break and, too often, I find myself getting discouraged or feeling impatient at the slow progress I'm making. Thank you for sharing your experience.

Eagerly looking forward to the new piece!

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

It does seem to take me a long, long time to finish my fics - but then, they are awfully long by the time I'm done with them. I was feeling a tad guilty because I know I said "January" and it's already March. So I thought if I let people in on what was happening, they might forgive me.

[shytobeknown.livejournal.com]

I admit that I don't know much about writing. I've only tried some drabbles and a short fic myself, but I have to say that I'm completely awed by your dedication. And it pays off too. ATBT is just a beautiful fic. I didn't even know there was gonna be a sequel and I'm so glad to read that there is gonna be. Anyway I wanted to let you know I've friended you. :)

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Thank you! And you can see that I really am writing the sequel and not just talking about it in my LJ.

[fourth_rose]

Thanks for this insight into your writing process! As I'm struggling with my first WIP at the moment, it's always interesting how other people are doing it (though for me, there's the 'writing in a foreign language'-factor, too - I noticed that it's a completely different process from writing in your native language).

I think it goes without saying that I'm very much looking forward to reading the sequel when you're done...

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

Oh, writing in a language that isn't your first must be so hard! I beta for painless_j, who's Russian, and I found myself explaining all the subtle differences between: hold on, hold off, hold up, hold down, hold back, hold forth, hold in, hold out, hold over, hold under... it was boggling!

[passinggo.livejournal.com]

Oh, this was fascinating. I'm not much of a fic writer myself, so it's especially interesting to see some of what goes on, and just how much work goes into it. *adding to memories*

I agree that, for us on the outside, it can seem like writing talent is all a person needs for the writing to come easily. Obviously that's not true, and that's one of the things I love about the really plotty fics like ATBT and its sequel: it's encouraging to realise that no, the author can't have just picked up a pen and had a flawless story fall out of the end.

It's intimidating too, to see the amount of work that goes into your writing, but it's also very inspiring because it makes me feel that, even when a lot of editing is necessary for what I write and it seems very hard work, it doesn't mean that the work itself is hopeless.

Now I'm waiting in hope of more writers doing a little picking-apart-with-commentary. :)

[geoviki.livejournal.com]

I was wondering if I was unique in spending so much time beating my writing into shape - it seems to take me so long.

I'd love it if more writers let us in on their processes.

[kattiya.livejournal.com]

You give me too much credit darling.

Read this awhile ago (fascinating stuff, love the behind-the-scenes glimpse), but finally coming out of hiding cause I have notes for you!! Finally. Sending it over right now.

xo